Since You Asked

Exceeding the red line

Dear Rod:
I occasionally like to hook up with one of the instructors at a local FBO and get some training. I have typically done some hood work and emergency procedures.

Yesterday I asked a young instructor with whom I'd never flown if he would do some spins with me in a Cessna 152. He mentioned that he'd had some difficulty getting the airplane to spin in the past but would be willing to give it a try. We got up to 5,000 feet agl, and he tried to enter a spin by cross-controlling the airplane in one direction while inducing a clean power-off stall and then rapidly turning the control wheel in the other direction.

What he actually succeeded in doing was getting us into a steep nose-down spiral. I noticed that the G forces seemed a bit high, and when I looked at the airspeed indicator it was pegged (well above V_NE). I told him that I never wanted to get in that situation again, but was willing to try one more attempt at a spin if he could keep the speed down. He made a brief attempt without success and we headed home. I'm just wondering how close we were to snapping the wings off and what the proper procedure is for getting a 152 to spin.

I did not report this incident to the FBO owner, as I'm sure the instructor learned a lesson. I will never fly with this kid again. I'm going to get my spin training with a pro.
Thank you,
JK

Greetings JK:
If we were to ground every airplane that exceeded V_NE at one time or another, there probably wouldn't be too many airplanes left flying. If, however, the airspeed needle was pegged above V_NE (red line), then you really don't know how fast you were going. On the other hand, V_NE is established at 90 percent of the design dive speed (V_D), which is the speed at which airplanes must be shown to be free from flutter, among other things. So it's possible you didn't exceed V_D. Then again, there's nothing that says that the moment you do, the airplane will self-destruct in a flutter frenzy. There are many variables at play here, but it's safe to say that you don't exceed V_NE no matter what, if you want to be safe.

Your own recommendation is the wise course of action here. Find a more experienced instructor who knows something about spins and how to get into as well as out of them.

Retractable trainer?

Dear Rod:
I have inherited a 1980 Cessna 172RG equipped with a constant-speed propeller. Am I allowed under the regulations to use this plane to earn my private pilot certificate?
Thanks for your help,
Douglas

Greetings Douglas:
There's no reason at all why you can't use this airplane to earn your private pilot certificate. Pilots can and do learn to fly in retractable-gear airplanes. It's not my first choice for the ideal flight training airplane, however. More relevant to you, it may not be your insurance company's first (or last) choice. Before you begin training, call your insurance company. Mention the words "student," "solo," and "in the retractable-gear airplane you insure" in the same sentence. The answer will make it pretty clear whether you should use this airplane or rent something else for your training.

Instrument insights

Dear Rod:
I am interested in earning an instrument rating. I had two false starts because of more important issues disrupting my training. Because of these experiences, I am interested in accelerated instrument training to earn the rating between life events.

I read that you identify several vendors who provide accelerated instrument training. I discovered that one of the vendors is not currently providing the service. The other two come to your location and use your own aircraft and require that you have the knowledge test completed before you start. I don't own an airplane, but I have access to two IFR-equipped aircraft in a club. However, the club has restrictions on nonmember instructors.

After searching for awhile I have not discovered many vendors who provide this training method. Does the apparent small number of vendors imply a lack of success using this training method? Are economic conditions responsible or am I not looking in the correct place? Do you agree with my assessment and do you continue to approve of this training method? Do you recommend completing the knowledge test before starting an accelerated training program?

I am very interested in your comments.
John

Greetings John:
First, I am a big fan of accelerated instrument training for one very important and distinct reason: You are guaranteed to get a good, experienced instructor your first time out. At least that's been my experience with companies like PIC. I've had the opportunity to fly with PIC-trained students over the years and I've heard nothing but good things about this company. To be fair, there are undoubtedly other companies that perform just as well, but I don't have much experience with them and I can't offer an informed opinion. The best way to find out about these companies is to call them and ask to talk directly with their most recent students. This is the best way to determine whether or not an accelerated instrument training company will suit your needs.

Regarding the small number of vendors in the accelerated training area, I don't believe this is in any way reflects on the success of this training method. I suspect that the number of people in this business is simply a matter of market demand, nothing more. And yes, I do recommend passing the knowledge test before engaging in accelerated instrument training. To wait until you start your flight training to prep for the knowledge exam is very unwise, in my opinion.

Accelerated instrument training could wind up providing you with more actual instrument experience. This is dependent on two factors. First, you'd need to train in an environment where it's possible to experience actual instrument conditions. Second, your instructor will probably want to take advantage of whatever time is available to fly. This means flying in actual conditions (if these conditions exist) as often as possible during the 10-day (or so) training period.

Overall, if you can't dedicate the time for extended instrument training, then accelerated training is a wise investment.

Rod Machado is a flight instructor, author, educator, and speaker. A pilot since 1970 and a CFI since 1973, he has flown more than 8,000 hours and is part owner of a Cessna P210. Visit his Web site.